Nope. Other cultures create multi-generational names. And relationships can refer to other things besides "son of" or "daughter of". Here are the examples straight from Da Rulz, that is, the Standards for Evaluation of Names and Armory, SENA for short. "For example, Miryam bint Da'ud is not an unmistakable claim to be the child of Da'ud ibn Auda, but Miryam bint Da'ud ibn Auda is. Felicia uxor Willemi le Tailor is an unmistakable claim to be the wife of a registered Willemus le Tailor, even though there is a change in appearance of the given name, because the change is necessitated by the grammar. However, Felicia uxor William Taylor is not an unmistakable claim to be the wife of Willemus le Tailor, as William Taylor and Willemus le Tailor are different enough to be clear of identity conflict under our rules. Similarly, Llewelyn ap Owen is an unmistakable claim to be the father of a registered Morgan ap Llewelyn ap Owen. "For example, Mary Elizabeth Smith is an unmistakable claim to be the daughter of Elizabeth Smith even though a relational marker is not included. This type of relationship conflict occurs only in languages, such as English, where unmarked patronymics or matronymics are used. However, Giulia Maddelena di Giacomo is not an unmistakable claim to be the daughter of Maddelena di Giacomo, as Italian did not mix marked (di Giacomo) and unmarked (Maddelena) relationships in the same name. Thus, in this case, Maddelena must be considered a second given name." tl;dr - it varies from language to language and culture to culture. Some rules are subtle and complex, others are simple. Ask a herald. If that herald doesn't know, he or she will ask other heralds who do. D^ On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 1:22 PM, Caitlin Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Interesting. Does relationship conflict happen for anybody other than the > Welsh? I assume (perhaps incorrectly?) that it only applies when using two > or more identifiers of heritage. > > On a related note, can Norse -dottirs use the parent's nickname, or only > first name? (I'm now picturing Ingeborg Beinlessdottir, although that > might fall into presumption.) > > -Ingeborg > > -Ingeborg > On Nov 7, 2014 11:52 AM, "Dorcas Whitecap" <[log in to unmask]> > wrote: > >> One of the requirements for registering a name or device in the SCA is >> that it must be unique. When a submitted item is too much like something >> that is already registered, that failure of uniqueness is referred to as a >> conflict. Two of the items I registered below are referred to as "Blanket >> Permission to Conflict". >> >> >> >> There are a couple of kinds of conflict when talking about names. >> Identity conflict is when two people share a name, like Duncan. A >> simple way to clear this conflict is to add some kind of descriptor, like >> “Eardstapa” or “of Skeene”, or a surname, like “Mac Torquill”. But >> identity conflict might happen when two names aren’t exactly alike, but >> close enough to be confusing. Imagine “Duncan Mac Torquill” and “Duncan >> MacTorville” both fighting in the Toys for Tots tournament! Therefore, >> SCA rules say that to be clear of identity conflict, two names must be >> substantially different in both sound and appearance. Now, Duncan Mac >> Torquill could grant permission for somebody to register the name Duncan >> MacTorville. There’s a process for the other person to ask for a Letter >> of Permission to Conflict. He might not get it, but it’s worth asking. One >> of my Blanket Permissions below simply removes the need for somebody to >> track me down and explicitly ask me if it’s okay to register a name like >> “Dorcas Lightcap” or “Fnorcas Whitecap”. My personal feeling is that >> I’m fine with that. YMMV. >> >> >> >> Another kind of name conflict is by relationship. Relationship conflict >> is when names make two people appear to be related, by marriage or by blood. >> “Rhianwen ferch Bran ap Gruffydd” is the daughter of Bran, who is the son >> of Gruffydd. This name can be registered as long as there is nobody >> with the registered name of “Bran ap Gruffydd”, or if there is, he grants >> permission for Rhianwen to register a name that implies she is his daughter. >> My second Blanket Permission below again removes the need for somebody to >> track me down to explicitly ask me if it’s okay to register a name like >> “John DorcasWhitecapson”. Okay, that name has other problems, but >> relationship conflict isn’t one of them, since my Blanket Permission is on >> record. >> >> >> >> The third item I registered below is a Heraldic Will. If I’m not around >> to decide what to do with my name and armory, Gold Falcon gets to decide. >> I could register a Blanket Permission to conflict with my device, like I >> have done with my name, but I don’t care to. If somebody wants to >> register a device that looks like mine, after I’m dead I don’t imagine I’ll >> need it, so some future Gold Falcon can grant that permission. You can >> will your heraldry to anybody, not just another herald. >> >> >> >> Registering a Heraldic Will or a Blanket Permission to Conflict doesn’t >> cost anything. Doing so is an act of generosity and kindness toward >> future SCAdians. Somebody might come up with a really cool name or >> device, and you might not think that it conflicts with yours, or might not >> mind, but if they can’t find you to get your permission, they are out of >> luck. See your local herald about registering a Heraldic Will or >> Blanket Permission to Conflict today! >> >> >> >> Thanks for asking. >> >> >> D^ >> >> On Fri, Nov 7, 2014 at 12:45 AM, Caitlin Smith < >> [log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >>> Dorcas did things I haven't heard of before! >>> Tell us about them, please, Mistress Heraldry Goob. >>> >>> -Ingeborg >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 6:49 PM, Jeremy Sacksteder < >>> [log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> >>>> Greetings to All, >>>> ... snip ... >>>> * *Dorcas Whitecap. * Blanket permission to conflict by identity with >>>> name. Dorcas grants permission to conflict for any name that is at >>>> least a syllable different from her registered name. >>>> * *Dorcas Whitecap. * Blanket permission to conflict by relationship >>>> with name. Dorcas grants permission to use her registered name in part >>>> of another name, thus creating a claim of relationship. Such a permission >>>> to conflict is covered in PN3E and Appendix D of SENA. >>>> * *Dorcas Whitecap. * Heraldic will. Upon her death, Dorcas's heraldic >>>> will transfers control of her currently registered items to the office of >>>> the Gold Falcon Principal Herald of the Kingdom of Calontir. >>>> >>> .. snip ... >> -- Manage your subscription at http://listserv.unl.edu. listserv.unl.edu >> lists do not accept incoming email from Yahoo.com, AOL.com or Dropbox.com >> due to their DMARC policies. > > -- Manage your subscription at http://listserv.unl.edu. listserv.unl.edu > lists do not accept incoming email from Yahoo.com, AOL.com or Dropbox.com > due to their DMARC policies. -- Manage your subscription at http://listserv.unl.edu. listserv.unl.edu lists do not accept incoming email from Yahoo.com, AOL.com or Dropbox.com due to their DMARC policies.