No comment at this time.

Murdoch


Date: Mon, 3 Nov 2014 21:00:58 -0600
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [CALONTIR] Long winded answer WAS RE: When can new people play?
To: [log in to unmask]

And archery?

-Ingeborg

On Nov 3, 2014 5:33 PM, "Bruce Lapham" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
So...uhm...I guess this would be mine to answer.  Sadly, it's all kind of confusing and sometimes vague.

An event, as defined by corporate, is any official/sponsored get together that is announced in the standard way.  What is the standard way, you ask?  That depends.  For local meetings/practices/farbles, it can mean via email, webpage, FB, word of mouth, meeting announcement, semifore, smoke signals, kumi-daiko messaging.  Whatever!  For Kingdom events (those things we drive to on weekends and occassionaly for a whole week) must be announced in the Kingdom newsletter.  The difference is that Kingdom Court business can happen at a Kingdom event, but not any old ordinary event.  Royal events are the special Kingdom events described in Calontir law.

Demos are a wierd beastie.  Since the local group announced it, it gets covered by insurance.  Because it is wide open to the general public, it has a couple of special rules.  They mostly come from the legal (read seneschal) side of things.  Rather than listing the individual scenarios that have been made illegal over the years, the general rule is that the public cannot participate in combat related activities.

As it was related to me by the previous SocSen, someone threw a fit about allowing "mundanes" to fight in armour at renfest like demos, so that was made illegal.  Someone found a loophole and started "whack-a-knight."  Someone else threw a fit about that not being within the spirit of the rule, so that was made illegal.  Someone decided that they would just have people sign a waiver, declare it a fighter practice, and then work with the public.  Again, someone threw a fit and that was made illegal.

The general idea is that if someone walks up to the SCA at a demo and puts on armour, they might not really grasp the concept of what they are getting into.  Someone who comes to a practice or an event has at least a basic idea that people are actually hitting each other and it isn't all just stage craft and fakery.

The insurance thing comes up a lot because it is an easy scapegoat that will assuage peoples objections.  The SCA insurance does not cover injury.  If anybody gets injured during an SCA activity, they must rely on their own insurance.  The SCA insurance is mostly for property damage caused by the activities of the event, although we all know that it has other uses for protecting the corporation. 

What if they sue, you ask?  Well, (speaking as a teacher and not a lawyer here) I'm pretty sure that the courts have set clear guidelines on that one.  The courts have regularly held that certain sporting activities have inherent dangers and that participating in the activity restricts (or completely negates) your ability to sue over injury.  We use the waivers as proof that the parties involved knew that it was possibly dangerous.

So, here's the short version.
A demo is covered by insurance, but the rules say we can't put people in armour or let them try it out until they come to a practice or event.


Whew...

Murdoch, the guy who is almost done and won't have to answer these type of questions any more.




Date: Mon, 3 Nov 2014 15:48:02 -0600
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [CALONTIR] When can new people play?
To: [log in to unmask]

Well, we don’t let people ride horses without proper forms and procedures, regardless of whether it’s a “regular” event or a demo (or anything else), but I don’t think this is in line with your question (I just wanted a clarification concerning horses – we don’t do pony rides). I’ll let someone else respond to the question of what makes an event “official”.   ;]
 
 
Eringlin
 
 
 
From: Clayton Neff [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2014 3:14 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [CALONTIR] When can new people play?

 
I am confused about when an event is not really an event.
It is my understanding that all SCA gatherings that expect to be covered by the SCA insurance are considered "events" and require signed waivers for all participants. This includes wars, tournaments, practices, A&S events, everything.

Is that correct?

If so, what about demos? Again, it is my understanding that these are "events" and all participants must have a signed waiver. But I have heard from several different sources that we absolutely CAN NOT let any people at demos sign a waiver and try our activities out, because INSURANCE.
Is that correct?

If so, then how do we get away with letting people try stuff at other events? Is there some magic wand we have to waive that I am unaware of? Is there something we aren't doing at demos that we are doing at all other events that makes letting someone shoot archery or ride a horse be covered by the insurance?

Or are we perpetuating a well meaning myth? Or are demos not events, so they aren't covered by the insurance? Can someone with better knowledge of / access to the rules attempt to explain this to my poor brain?
Please note that I am NOT pointing any fingers at people for not allowing new folks to participate. I firmly believe that everyone is trying to follow the rules at laid down by corporate to the best of their abilities. I am just confused as to what those rules are and why the are interpreted they way they are.
Thanks.
-- Logan --
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