I agree on what Jean Paul has said as re. the SCA Order of Chilvary. However, I would suggest that the usage of theword "marital art" has several different meanings and symantic uses. I believe it to be, in this case, the word "martial" is being used as a means to describe a disciplined manner of fighting. Both Hard Suit & Rapier require hours & hours of training, discipline & commitment. We must be able to discuss this reasonable, and not give over to the distractions. Take time to say what you mean and mean what you say. Be as precise and accurate as you can, only then can we move forward and get to the meat of the matter. Just my 2 sheckels' worth, M. Jalali of Salamis, etc., etc.... ________________________________ From: Jean Paul de Sens <[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Thursday, December 4, 2014 11:41 AM Subject: Re: [CALONTIR] Proposed Peerage for Masters of Defense I always twitch about about commenting on some of these threads, because while I travel there a lot, I don't live in Calontir. Having said that, Alban, your statement shows your beliefs, not what is. "...the Chivalry for martial arts". The SCA order of the Chivalry is awarded for excellence in rattan combat, not in martial arts. You may feel that it *should* be that way, but that is not representative of what it is. Great at Shinai fighting -> Not a SCA knight. Great at Ju-jitsu -> Not a SCA knight. Great at Boffer -> Not a SCA knight. Great at jousting -> Not a SCA knight. Great at Greco-Roman wrestling -> not a SCA knight. There are hundreds (thousands?) of martial arts, and proficiency in only 1 of them will make you elegible for SCA knighthood. I do not find it unusual for 2000 members skilled in this one art form to be uncomfortable or unwilling to change the membership requirements as it would be for 2000 Karate practitioners to suddenly award belts to SCA knights. JP On Thu, Dec 4, 2014 at 11:05 AM, Ted Eisenstein <[log in to unmask]> wrote: The SCA currently has three peerages - the Laurel for arts and sciences, the Pelican for >service, the Chivalry for martial arts. In Calontir, the very strong tradition was for a long >while against allowing "cut and thrust", aka fencing, at all; obviously, if no-one could >do it, there'd be no reason to allow a fourth peerage for that activity. Qui mieux fait, mieux vault. -- Manage your subscription at http://listserv.unl.edu/. listserv.unl.edu lists do not accept incoming email from Yahoo.com, AOL.com or Dropbox.com due to their DMARC policies. -- Manage your subscription at http://listserv.unl.edu. listserv.unl.edu lists do not accept incoming email from Yahoo.com, AOL.com or Dropbox.com due to their DMARC policies.