Several have mentioned - Well, what about being welcomed by the Laurels and Pelicans? To which I respond - Please don't. (( Note: This is mine, and only MY, personal, opinion - DO NOT TAKE THIS as indicative of all equestrian member thoughts, as it is NOT representative of every individual's experience or personal journey or viewpoint.)) Eowyth's Personal Opinion (EPO) (since I have not seen an equestrian comment on this thread and I feel like there should be *some* representation because people keep mentioning us): I would be saddened and _slightly_ disappointed for the Laurels OR the Pelicans to recognize me for my *skills* on the equestrian martial field, as opposed to my knowledge or service given to the Kingdom & Knowne Worlde. I want the Laurels to recognize my work & teaching on equestrian & horse training techniques, equine breeding knowledge, research into the history of horses in the medieval ages, clothing horses in the medieval times, rider clothing, and my (currently budding) knowledge of leather-working or metal-working as it applies to equestrian things (and other things, as the scope expands). And my teaching & sharing of the above (and to be discovered) knowledge with others. But Not because I'm a hot lance, look good, and score well on the jousting field. I want the Pelicans to recognize my service as a retainer for the Kingdom, as local Exchequer, as a Kingdom Officer's Deputy, a Kingdom Officer (one day), a Society Officer's Deputy, a Society Officer (one day), an event steward & crew chief, as a marshal, and as a contributing member to the Kingdom and the Knowne Worlde. And not because I can hold my own in the Lysts. My skills as an equestrian have little or *nothing* to do with my research, service, or creative products (i.e. Caparisons, bridles, etc.). And to have them shoved together "because" makes my heart heavy and my head hurt. I feel that one part of what I do is simply being overlooked because it doesn't "fit" anywhere or that my other accomplishments are being pushed aside because that skill is more "ooh shiny" (because ponies) than those Laurel-type items (such as research, etc.) or Pelican-type items (such as serving as a Local/Kingdom/Society officer, etc.). Which is why I was thrilled, delighted, and ecstatic when the Eo orders were created - FINALLY. Finally, the *skills* on the field would be recognized for what they were - PROWESS on the Martial Field. Not service as a torse or teaching & creating as a leather mallet. How to become a Peer from there? Well - that's another discussion (no really - these are two separate discussions, albeit related). If the Laurels or Pelicans were to one day think that I am worthy enough to be considered a fellow member of Their Orders, I would *hope* from the deepest parts of my heart that it would be not because "You're a good equestrian on the field" but because I actually fit what it means to be a Laurel or Pelican. Because I have created (or researched) amazing medieval topics or I have served to the utmost of my capacity. Not because I know how to ride & compete. Anyway, all that to say - those who know me well, know where I stand on the "Additional Peerage" subject, but that opinion has nothing to do with this opinion of I do not believe that a Skilled Equestrian should be considered a Pelican or a Laurel based on Prowess (as the two orders currently stand and are defined as). I want to earn those Accolades based on the Merits befitting a Laurel or Pelican, and I don't consider _martial_ prowess to be included in what defines a Pelican or Laurel. My quarter & change opinion. Sorry for the rambling. Ever & always in service, Eowyth þa Siðend -- Manage your subscription at http://listserv.unl.edu. listserv.unl.edu lists do not accept incoming email from Yahoo.com, AOL.com or Dropbox.com due to their DMARC policies.