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I concur with previous comments so far, but I'd like to make one criticism
if I may, brought to you from someone who absolutely respects science and
admires scientists....

"Do we really know there is a biodiversity crisis in invertebrates?"  While
this is a fair question, and whereas many of my learned colleagues have
repeatedly stated that we do not have adequate, quantitative, historical
data to reach any kind of conclusion on the state of abundance and
diversity of invertebrates....None of them is saying "Our bad, we did not
know we would ever need this information.  Our priorities in funding and
research have revolved overwhelmingly around the impacts of insects on
human health, agriculture, and to a lesser degree on forestry.  In essence,
entomology research has been almost exclusively *economic entomology*
research."

Instead, what we hear is how evidence of insect decline is anecdotal,
amateurish, and mostly useless information.  Wow.  We wonder why people
don't trust science any longer.  It is this kind of condescending attitude
and refusal to accept responsibility for "failures" of science that piss
people off.  It is kind of a wonder we have any citizen scientists at all
when they are valued only slightly.

Clarifying *why* we, as scientists, are skeptical of an "insect apocalypse"
would go a long way to improving public understanding of the controversy,
and go a long way in rebuilding public trust in the scientific method that
requires reproducible results.

Eric R. Eaton
[log in to unmask]
Lead author, *Kaufman Field Guide to Insects of North America*
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bugeric.blogspot.com_&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=ROJKXgV0mldjbRMnlhcmFVzvCFqkYoBwOcU-HNL9esA&s=gsg_Dc7FB4KLvWgLXLEd21QXYWY3p3ne9P2bqchSirE&e= 

On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 11:38 AM laurence packer <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

> Well, there's a special issue in insect conservation and diversity coming
> out in March
> on insect declines - the editorial that starts it is fairly critical of
> the insect apocalypse
> narrative, but the solid empirical papers that follow it are pretty good
> at determining
> that many decines are real - you just need good, long datasets to show it.
> Doug's point is perfect though.
> cheers
>
> laurence
>
> On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 1:24 PM Lynn Kimsey <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Doug,
>>
>> That was my take on the survey. Do we really know there is a biodiversity
>> crisis in invertebrates? We don’t have enough background data to be sure
>> except in collections and we lack alpha taxonomists to deal with the issue.
>> DNA isn’t going to solve everything.
>>
>> Lynn
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Entomological Collections Network Listserve <
>> [log in to unmask]> *On Behalf Of *Doug Yanega
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 11, 2020 10:19 AM
>> *To:* [log in to unmask]
>> *Subject:* Re: Biodiversity Crisis - We need your input
>>
>>
>>
>> "We have developed a short online survey that we hope will capture the
>> information we need to formulate a meaningful response.
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tiny.cc_biocrisis&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=ROJKXgV0mldjbRMnlhcmFVzvCFqkYoBwOcU-HNL9esA&s=LonoHlDMIYMyOowVGNic696JtxXdMDmO8RZjGS2YpKE&e= "
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tiny.cc_biocrisis&d=DwMFAg&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=svMlQwGevn9uqNrpxRJ2yJpVdtCjQ3_9IKGzhmbqTyE&s=_36g9gn3ccJQs7in_wF0OOyeADV7eZCMs9FLKvqkAEI&e=>
>>
>> Having just completed this survey, I'll note that among the agenda items
>> we're asked to prioritize, two of them ask about the need for funding or
>> leading conservation efforts, but none of them ask about the need for
>> funding or leading *curatorial* efforts, such as training and supporting
>> taxonomists to provide identifications for natural history collections, or
>> capturing and mobilizing specimen data.
>>
>> I think all of us in the community understand that you can't promote
>> effective assessment or management of biodiversity if you don't know what
>> the organisms are, or where they live, and while I don't doubt for a minute
>> that the people in SPNHC are fully aware of this fundamental need, I do
>> have to wonder why it does not appear anywhere in the survey, when it seems
>> to me that it should be an integral part of the discussion. After all, it's
>> not like this work has been completed, or is anywhere even close to
>> complete - there isn't a natural history collection in the world that has
>> all of its holdings databased, online, AND fully reviewed for accuracy
>> (both accuracy of data, *and* accuracy of identification). Is this not
>> one of the highest priorities we in the collections community need to
>> address in terms of the biodiversity crisis? How useful are our millions
>> upon millions of specimens if we don't know whether we can trust the data,
>> or trust the IDs?
>>
>> I'm not really looking for a public response, but I do want to encourage
>> people taking the survey to make use of the comments towards the end to
>> give feedback, and expand upon the very limited selection of agenda items
>> in the survey, if you agree with me that there are some fundamental things
>> missing.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> --
>>
>> Doug Yanega      Dept. of Entomology       Entomology Research Museum
>>
>> Univ. of California, Riverside, CA 92521-0314     skype: dyanega
>>
>> phone: (951) 827-4315 (disclaimer: opinions are mine, not UCR's)
>>
>>              https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__faculty.ucr.edu_-7Eheraty_yanega.html&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=ROJKXgV0mldjbRMnlhcmFVzvCFqkYoBwOcU-HNL9esA&s=ANIQbtkCGXC0AIcRdaL6K_6s8TAYvj5nN1sAKeDPB5Q&e=  <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__faculty.ucr.edu_-7Eheraty_yanega.html&d=DwMC-g&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=_PReq4cDpS69hv4QcpjKv299nv_wq2d2XXLnYbKr_ss&s=FCdx4VFdB-V006ajnmn9d-cibPnA8M_uviIutkVXpqc&e=>
>>
>>   "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness
>>
>>         is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82
>>
>>