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Speaking up as Margaret K Thayer :-)  I'm pretty sure that "Thayer
Expedition" refers to a large set of records from the 1800s and thus a very
different Thayer - I believe John E., but I'm not positive.

Getting old, but not that old!
Margaret


*Margaret K. Thayer, Ph.D.*  she/her
Curator Emerita and Lecturer (Committee on Evolutionary Biology)
Field Museum and University of Chicago
O: 312.665.7741 (direct)

Field Museum
1400 S. Lake Shore Drive
Chicago IL 60605
fieldmuseum.org FMNH personal web page
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__fieldmuseum.org_users_margaret-2Dthayer&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=IEJDPkk0mjbAVuBVwkkxiqGbFHqRQMm0KxH453ssJyI&s=ady_FdYJYcYUtMS4rKwyh9C8zmenU9FfIE8MjmP8mxM&e= >
FMNH Insects collection database
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.fieldmuseum.org_explore_department_zoology_insects_collections&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=IEJDPkk0mjbAVuBVwkkxiqGbFHqRQMm0KxH453ssJyI&s=RKFKQ8CbCAuZ1AI-i5xDjHTJRnySZn-AOBgy45erOyo&e= >
 Austral Staphylinidae & Staphyliniformia
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__archive.fieldmuseum.org_peet-5Fstaph_&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=IEJDPkk0mjbAVuBVwkkxiqGbFHqRQMm0KxH453ssJyI&s=HWoyd5VOP-oKMAN_VyosRWwyjI7rmKYmM1b63UcThVU&e= >


<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__fieldmuseum.org&d=DwIFaQ&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=IEJDPkk0mjbAVuBVwkkxiqGbFHqRQMm0KxH453ssJyI&s=PUjPxDYOZfG1hP7poSwJZ-KuWMhjgC7ZuDlNhH36f3c&e= >



On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 6:33 PM Neil Stanley Cobb <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Thanks Rachel,
>
>
>
> I wish this was available in all the cms systems and/or a centralized
> table that everyone could access.  So picking up on one of Crystal’s
> examples of M. Thayer, the collector Margaret Kathryn Thayer has specimens
> deposited in a number of museums under M. Thayer, M. K. Thayer, Thayer
> expedition?? (or is that a separate butterfly person?).  So if there was a
> shared vetted table then that could be available to the community like
> GeoLocate.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Neil
>
>
>
> *From:* Rachel Hawkins <[log in to unmask]>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 6, 2020 4:08 PM
> *To:* Neil Stanley Cobb <[log in to unmask]>
> *Cc:* [log in to unmask]
> *Subject:* Re: database and collector's names
>
>
>
> Neil - Paul Morris would definitely be the one to talk to on that. As far
> as I can tell, our specimen records link to the agent table directly. Each
> agent record has multiple names that we can use to locate the right agent
> depending on variants. See below for a screenshot example from MCZbase. The
> "preferred name" is what shows up for specimen records. "Author" names show
> up with publications.
>
>
>
> I wish we had a verbatim agent field, but like Crystal noted, we might
> have a verbatim label transcription attribute or remark that captures that
> information elsewhere.
>
> [image: Screenshot (214).png]
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 6:32 PM Neil Stanley Cobb <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
> So I would put it into dynamicProperties and ideally it would be in json
> format – Katja would know.
>
>
>
> I assume the MCZ "master" agent record was created by Paul Morris.  It
> would be interesting to see where that capability is for all cms systems.
> I like putting in verbatim agent in a master table better than the dynamicProperties
> option, but is the master agent table only available in the MCZ database?
>
>
>
> *From:* Entomological Collections Network Listserve <
> [log in to unmask]> *On Behalf Of *Zhuang, Mingna
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 6, 2020 3:27 PM
> *To:* [log in to unmask]
> *Subject:* Re: database and collector's names
>
>
>
> ​Hi Christy,
>
>
>
> We also do things similar to MCZ in terms of attaching collector names
> that are obvious. For ones that are not obvious, the system we use (Arctos)
> has "verbatim collector" as an attribute. SCAN harvests our data from
> Arctos and puts it into "Dynamic properties" when you view the full record
> details.
>
>
>
> Hope that helps,
>
> Vicky (Mingna) Zhuang Ph. D.
>
> UTEP Biodiversity Collections Manager
>
> B209 Biology Building
>
> Biological Sciences
>
> University of Texas El Paso
>
> 500 University Ave
>
> El Paso, TX, 79968
>
> Phone: 915-747-5479
>
> Instagram: @utepbc
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__twitter.com_utepbc&d=DwMFAw&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=feDfmunsU8DIOiALi6Yd14f7yOfi-nThKiMgyNNKbnM&s=z4cGK6FPK7vtJcUDb6f_9B7IQoRCBBYrtAd4KLx0c8E&e=>
>  twitter: @utepbc
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.instagram.com_utepbc_&d=DwMFAw&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=feDfmunsU8DIOiALi6Yd14f7yOfi-nThKiMgyNNKbnM&s=CInhk_B4Ym2GQ66VyW5W5uGl5AI2pCrOZMx-CMiY738&e=>
>  Facebook: UTEP Biodiversity Collections
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.facebook.com_utepbiodiversitycollections_&d=DwMFAw&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=feDfmunsU8DIOiALi6Yd14f7yOfi-nThKiMgyNNKbnM&s=4FeLo94MNeXtA_z7-IEU9xYi3oVF-PpnUEA50iVIyf4&e=>
>
> Website
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.utep.edu_biodiversity_&d=DwMFAw&c=Cu5g146wZdoqVuKpTNsYHeFX_rg6kWhlkLF8Eft-wwo&r=-lUMCZ4RK28H4qvcd3vmEBuyVJHHG0OpDzFenR9wX-A&m=feDfmunsU8DIOiALi6Yd14f7yOfi-nThKiMgyNNKbnM&s=78Gb3dvxhXfVskg7jn5FaL-apZ2tRSKETlQdzc427xc&e=>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Entomological Collections Network Listserve <
> [log in to unmask]> on behalf of Maier, Crystal <
> [log in to unmask]>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, May 6, 2020 4:13 PM
> *To:* [log in to unmask]
> *Subject:* Re: database and collector's names
>
>
>
> Hi Christy,
>
>
>
> We don't have a "verbatim collector" field in MCZBase. We attach the
> collector name to the specimen that best fits the specimen label, unless
> there is some ambiguity.
>
>
>
> If the label says "J. Smith" I will attach a person [agent] called "J.
> Smith", unless there's come context that says otherwise.
>
> If it just says "Smith" we attach a person [agent] called "Smith",  unless
> there's come context that says otherwise.
>
> If it says "M. Thayer" [sorry, Margaret!] we'll attach the person [agent]
> "Margaret Thayer" since that's a distinct enough name.
>
>
>
> One can add taxonomic or institutional knowledge to help guide, but when
> in doubt, I would go with a more general person [agent]
>
>
>
> This is a case for having either a "verbatim label" field for the
> specimen, or label images attached to the record that serve as a voucher in
> cases of interpretation.
>
>
>
> Hope that makes sense!
>
>
>
> Crystal
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 6, 2020 at 6:06 PM Christy Bills <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
> Quick question:
>
>
>
> When you are databasing specimens, if the label has a collector's
> initials, or some other shortened version of their name, but you know who
> it is, do you transcribe into the database who you are 99% sure the
> collector is or do you faithfully record the label data exactly as is?
>
>
>
> We are using Symbiota/SCAN and I don't see a field where it would be
> appropriate to make a notation that we made that assumption (like "verbatim
> collector data").
>
>
>
> Is this just me?  tbh, I'm finding it difficult to concentrate since this
> has all gone down!
>
> Happy to get replies just to me so we don't clutter this list.
>
>
>
> Thank you!
>
>
>
>
> Christy Bills
> Invertebrate Collections Manager
> Natural History Museum of Utah
> 301 Wakara Way
> Salt Lake City, Utah 84108
>
> pronouns: she/her
>
>
>
>
>
>    \     /
>     \   /
>      0 0
>    -{   }-
>    -{   }-
>    -(    )-
>      / \
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Crystal A. Maier, Ph.D.
>
> Curatorial Associate, Entomology
>
> Museum of Comparative Zoology, Harvard University
>
> 26 Oxford Street, Cambridge, MA, 02138 U.S.A.
>
>
>
> [log in to unmask]
>
> +1-617-496-1055
>
>
>
> --
>
> Rachel L. Hawkins
>
>
>
> Curatorial Assistant
>
> Entomology Dept. and Pierce Lab
>
> Museum of Comparative Zoology
>
> Harvard University
>
> 26 Oxford St.
>
> Cambridge MA 02138
>